Season 1 Ep 11 🎙️🎙️🎙️

The convergence of science and communication as a catalyst in empowering change in vulnerable communities with Jhpiego’s- Verah Vashti Okeyo

In this episode, we delve into a world where science and journalism intersect, uncovering the profound impact that they have in shaping a more informed society. Spearheading this mission is Verah Okeyo, a renowned science journalist, teacher, and communicator who has dedicated her career to bridging the gap between scientific advancements and public understanding specifically in healthcare. She recognizes the responsibility of science journalists in promoting scientific literacy and believes that science journalism has the potential to inspire the next generation of scientists and innovators, igniting a passion for discovery and problem-solving. Discover the power of storytelling, community engagement, and collaboration in shaping a world where science thrives and everyone has access to life-changing knowledge.

Verah Okeyo is a communications specialist, a teacher, and an award-winning science reporter. She has been a journalist for nine years, at Nation Media Group, one of the largest private media houses in East and Central Africa. Her reporting mostly focused on global health, humanitarian, gender, and environmental issues in the company’s print and digital departments. Currently, she is the Communications Manager at Jhpiego, a nonprofit global leader in the creation and delivery of transformative health care solutions for the developing world.

Here are key things to listen out for:

1. Community engagement and collaboration in science communication– Through her work as a science journalist, teacher, and communicator, Verah has dedicated herself to bridging the gap between scientific advancements and public understanding, particularly in the context of healthcare. She understands the importance of community engagement in fostering a more informed society and recognizes that collaboration is key to achieving this goal.
2. Promoting science literacy in journalism- Verah has actively mentored and guided upcoming science communicators, sharing her knowledge and expertise to empower them in their storytelling endeavors.
3. Pioneering the pathway to scientific understanding in healthcare: Ever since the eye-opening incident at Jaramogi Odinga Referral Hospital. Verah has been a mission to shape narratives in science journalism by focusing on health systems and vulnerable populations.
4. Igniting Passion for Discovery: Verah encourages the audience to embrace experimentation and thinking beyond conventions to make a lasting impact.

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Welcome to Mazungumzo, African scholarly conversations, a podcast that highlights the perspectives of various stakeholders in academia and research fields across Africa, through open dialogue or Mazungumzo on scholarly communication in Africa.

Joy Owango:

Welcome to Mazungumzo – African Scholarly Conversations where are joined by an expansive list of African policymakers, science communication specialists, innovators, and tertiary institution leads who contribute to the realm of scholarly communication. I’m your host Joy Owango, the Executive Director of the Training Centre in Communication (TCC Africa), based at the University of Nairobi, Kenya.

Today, we have the pleasure of talking to our long-time friend, Ms. Verah Vashti Okeyo, who is now the Communications Manager at Jhpiego. Verah is a communications specialist, a teacher, and an award-winning science reporter. She has been a journalist for nine years, at Nation Media Group, one of the largest private media houses in East and Central Africa. Her reporting mostly focused on global health, humanitarian, gender, and environmental issues in the company’s print and digital departments.  She is published in many outlets, including The Guardian and Foresight Global Health, and has a master’s in media and communications from the London School of Economics and Political Science.

A warm welcome to the programme Verah!

Verah Vashti Okeyo:

Thank you, Joy.

Joy Owango:

Thank you so much for joining us in today’s podcast. Can you share with us your background and how you transitioned into science journalism and communication.

Verah Vasthi Okeyo:

Actually, science journalism and communications is the only career I’ve had. I’ve just been walking in and out of the other. I grew up in an environment of two groups of people in my family, someone is either a teacher or works in health care, that is nurses, clinical officers and doctors. So, I grew up around a lot of a blend of creative and scientific knowledge. And being in a rural setup, made me very interested in innovation. You know, if you grew up in rural areas, there’s no refrigerator, there’s nothing else to make your work, smooth some of those things you have to do with your hands and if they’re not tools, you have to find a way. So I’ve always been a creative child, with a little bit of the analytical and the scientific because of my mother was a nurse. All of our brothers were doctors and clinical officers. And the other side of my father, they were either teachers, or musicians. So, it was a blend of those. When I was choosing my career, I went to high school in Bahati girls and I literally did everything. I was in the science club, the math club, the music club, the environmental journalism club. I was a captain of some of the games, I did everything. Eventually, towards the end of my teenage years, I realized, while I can do both, and was actually a better science student than I was in humanities and arts. I thrive in being in the creative industry. Initially, I was supposed to go study computer science, surprise-surprise, and then I changed into nursing, then I changed it to media and communication so I went to Maseno University, where I studied a double degree in media and communication, and Creative and Performing Arts. So that’s how I got into the industry and my first job. My first formal job, I’ve had other jobs, but my first formal job was in Nation as an intern just before I graduated, I came to Nation as an intern and sort of climbed the ladders from intern to editor in the span of all that time, but in between while being at Nation, I always used to tell my bosses “Oh my God, this is so boring, how could I just be a journalist throughout?, I need a break” and they would allow me to take sabbaticals and go for fellowships in the Netherlands, in New York. I really traveled during my time as a reporter doing fellowships, I really did a lot of things just to make me do that. So that’s how, at some point, I’m a journalist, and some point, I’m a communicator, because I’m able to balance being creative cause journalism is more about creativity and just getting the job done. Communication is more about serving an audience to be able to support the growth of an organization, which means you have to be very methodical and process-oriented. Right. So that’s how I ended up being in those careers.

Joy Owango: 

Your career has been a bit of a balance of being a communication specialist and a journalist, and with that balance what makes a great science story? Could you walk us through your process of creating science pieces from ideation and sourcing for information to print? And additionally, how do you get back into the writing process when the creative flow is interrupted?

Vera Vashti Okeyo:

Okay, so let’s start with my process of creating a writer. I will direct people to go listen to a TED Talk by Elizabeth Gilbert. There are two ways of how you can approach being a writer or being a communicator, you can be someone who is very prescriptive, that is, stories always follow this structure. So you follow those structures, then you try to frame and fill in those gaps. Now, I am not like that. The other type of how you can be a storyteller or a communicator is that you find inspiration, you collate things from the environment, from the music you listen to, from the people you talk to, and you make something out of it. I am more of the latter. I never sit down and I imagine “Yeah, today I’m going to write one science story”, It just comes. I could be reading, I could be talking to someone, I could be observing what’s happening on social media. That’s where I get my story, ideas. And sometimes it could be like, I like to read journals, or if you write about science, you get to read. Because unlike political stories, science is more about every sentence you write is a fact. It’s not what someone thinks, what someone observed what someone suggests would happen. It’s more about facts, something that has been tested, and something that comes from or spoken by people who have had a year or years of experience in that. So I read a lot of journals and then as I read, think hmm, that’s interesting, I think the public should know that. This is when I write for journalism outlets. So after I see that, I take notes and start to imagine what is going to make this story have flesh and interest and in such a way that, well it is interesting to me, but I know this is going to be boring to most sort of people. For instance, if you’re writing on antimicrobial resistance, it is a huge public health threat, but when you say antimicrobial resistance, It is so abstract, you know, people are like what? what is that? As compared to if you told people, murder in the city. People will be interested in that. So how do you make this story? I start looking for ways of how I can make that story interesting and how that happens is, first of all, if I’m going to write for a particular paper, I would look at their style. How do they write and also tap into my own style of writing, I’m very descriptive and symbolic in my style. If I want to talk about, 10,000 people that died. I’m the kind of person who is likely to tell you that the number of people who died were enough to fill up three up football stadiums in kasarani, or something I like to liken everything I’m writing about to people’s environment, because I live in those environments, and I soak up what’s happening in those environments. So, after that, you know you write, and when you allow yourself to get into the zone you write and then you remind yourself what the main purpose was, before you start writing again per se, in this article, I’m going to explore what antimicrobial resistance is, and the magnitude of the problem in Kenya, and the danger of it. I have to keep, as I’m writing, I have to keep getting back to that frame so that I do not go off topic. That’s how I do it.  Of course, then after, you take it to the editor who will edit it and give you back and forth and back and forth. So that’s my process. In summary, I’m not a prescriptive writer, I get inspiration from everywhere. You also asked, how I get back into writing when I`ve zoned out?

Joy Owango:

Yes. How do you, when you’ve zoned out, because you see, when you’re a descriptive writer, it needs inspiration, quite a bit of inspiration and sometimes that just dies out, and when it comes to science stories, unless it is a major story that is happening, that has an impact on a community or society or like the just concluded pandemic, you tend to zone out. So how do you keep your creative flow uninterrupted?

Vera Vashti Okeyo:

You have no control of how creativity is going to be interfered with. Sometimes it’s just there. Sometimes it’s not there at all. There are days, I can sit up on my computer and write non-stop for three days, no eating, maybe just drinking water, because those things are in my head, and I have to download them, and then when I am like- Oh my God, I wish I could just get out of my bed and just do something else. Number One, I usually tell creative people that discipline is very important, you have got to have a work process because unlike other jobs, a creative person, there’s no formula, literally every day, you have to create something out of nothing. You have to find a way so that on the days when there’s nothing to tap into, you’ll still be able to do your job. I have a process. When I was in the newsroom, I knew that my key deliverables were that I had to produce at least two stories every day. So there are some things I practice in such a way that I could literally write, most of my colleagues tell me, I could write with my eyes closed, because it is it’s like in my DNA because I practice every day. In a single day, I write between- daily for since I was I think around 14, I write between 1500 words to 6000 words every single day. And it’s not like I write them to take anywhere. Sometimes I just write because I want to journal. I write because I want to process the things that are in my head. That gives me some sort of structure so that even when I do not have that creativity. I can still give you an okay piece of work, but when I want to do something extra ordinary and it goes out. Recently, I’ve taught myself to just take a break and not punish myself, you know, sleeping is  important if you’re a creative person, I have never seen a creative person who sleeps. So sometimes you don’t sleep and you know, the brain just is like- Oh, I’m tired. I’m not working anymore. So I take a break and I sleep. Number two, I exercise. I run, I get out of the house. There’s something about the sun and being around trees, that does to people who write from not the prescriptive way, people who collect things like my writing style, as I had mentioned. I go, I like nature. I grew up in very rural forested natural places. So every time I feel like- Oh, my God, I’m dying. I just go to such kind of places where I grew up in Naivaisha, I go to Kongoni area near the platform’s, I ride horses. It will take me like around two days and I’ll be back on my element. Once I just leave the city, I leave people and I just go and stay in solitude in nature, around the lake, around animals, around horses in the ranch. No TV, no radio, no social media. I’ll be able to get back into my element and then continue writing.

Joy Owango :

Okay. So for you, exercise is very important. And I think it’s key for any person, beyond even creating, any kind of activity you need during the day exercise should be incorporated in it because it helps you. It helps you prepare for the day really. So, of course, there are frustrations that you’d go through when you’re writing stories as a science journalist, there are so many trends happening in higher education, and in research. Sometimes keeping up with them is a bit of a challenge, and also, having access to some of the researchers can also be a challenge. Despite this, are there any particular challenges or frustrations you face in your career as a science journalist, and as also now a communication specialist?

Vera Vashti Okeyo:

My frustrations are on two different levels. Let me not call them frustration, that would mean you’ve given up. My challenges cut across both fields. Some of them are specific to being a journalist and being in communications. Number one, journalism, let me just explain the difference between creating content for journalism and creating content for communications. Creating content for communications is like surgery. Someone has to, it’s not you alone, it’s what you do, someone else has to check it, someone else has to check it, and that checking and unchecking can take months. And normally, this happens, because when you create content in science communication, it’s rarely to educate the public, but it’s to communicate the impact of what the organization has done. This ties to the strategy of that organization, if there was a donor, what were they supposed to deliver to that donor? What is the brand of that organization? How do they like to present themselves?  if I worked for an organization, like, say, Google, Google are innovators, you know, you have got to inject that into their writing so that it is its own brand, own voice. Science communication products are rarely creative products, they are mostly corporate products because of that process, and the reason why that is like that is because you’d find there`s one creative, and the person who has the power to say this should move to the next and to the next are rarely storytellers, they’re rarely storytellers. They’re really creative people. As a matter of fact, sometimes they know nothing about even the structure of a story, but it’s their job to make sure that whatever is presented out there does not hurt the company and does not hurt its relationships. So the challenge that arises from that is, sometimes, you know, you could see this is of all these results that we have, this is what could sell the organization. But the people along the chain of approvals would not think about it that way. They will be like- I think that is too bold. I think we’re blowing our trumpets too much, and they will tone it down, and they’ll edit it. And you know, if it is scientists, they’ll use language that it is more of journal language, the way you’d write for nature in science and lancet. Yet, this is material that is supposed to go out to someone who is not, like let’s say you’re writing something about HIV, it could be going to a scientist, but not an HIV scientist, it could be an entomologist or something. So as far as that is concerned, that scientist even though he’s a PhD in another field is still a layman as far as the subject is concerned, and you should treat him as just an ordinary audience. So the challenge is usually in communications. Normally, content creators and communicators rarely get to work with their peers. They work with people who see everything through the eyes of research, medicine, chemistry, biology, rarely through the eyes of communication, so the product that comes out of which you like, I mean, it’s okay, but it could have had more magic. So that’s the challenge, but then you realize there’s a careful balance between this is going to get us the results we want and this is supposed to be a creative project. So that is what I find in the side of communications. Journalism, is different, like I said, communication is like surgery. In journalism, it is like a race, basically a bicycle, a sprint, technically, you got very tight deadlines and nobody’s going to sit there and see, oh, are you doing things the right way, they say, journalists are the only people who publish their mistakes. If you mess it up, you will put it out there and people will come down for your behind, and they will crucify you. So the goodness with that is, if you’re like me, very independent, and like to do your own things, that is a very easy thing to do. But the challenge can also be in the content that can come out. First of all, it may be full of misinformation, because you’re not a scientist yourself, and number two, it could be totally focusing on the wrong aspect. I will give you an example when people were reporting about that thing to do with gonorrhea and antimicrobial resistance, the biggest thing there was not that 20 people had that strain of gonorrhea. Absolutely not, because that was a very controlled study, and obviously, they were commercial sex workers so it was expected to find something like that.  The bigger story there was that antimicrobial resistance has become a huge problem, and it would have been a good opportunity to ask the government what they were doing about it, and what the scientists were going to do about it, but you see, it got overtaken by the home drum, the hullabaloo, and the laughter, and dubbed super gonorrhea and all that. That’s the challenge. Now, across the board in all fields, there’s a challenge for funding. Normally, creative departments in both sides, do not get adequate funding to tell stories. People have to make do and this limits. This means that creative people, even in terms of operation are always in survival mode. Let’s just get something out for the sake of, we’ve got to fill the paper, we’ve got to give a success story. They just do the bare minimum. Stories are what change democracies, as far as journalism is concerned, and stories are what fundraise for organizations as far as communication is concerned. If money was put into those things, then hire the right people, give them autonomy, and allow them to do their work. I think both fields would really go far.

Joy Owango:

Putting all this into context and with that experience how would you share with us your transition from being a science journalist to a communications specialist, particularly with this international program, Jhpiego.

Vera Vashti Okeyo:

I don’t think I’ve left being a journalist per say. I don’t think I’ll ever stop being one. It this is just another phase of my life. Being a communicator. It’s just another phase of my life as a storyteller, and I walk in and out of those fields. For instance, I have both of my feet, 70% of it is in communications at Jhpiego and the other one is in the newsroom, sort of because I still work with journalists, not to sell Jhpiego but it benefits the global health community, if reporters are able to report on global health accurately. It doesn’t have to benefit us as an organization or AMREF or Global fund. It is just important that people get accurate information from the media. Given that, number one, there is no school that is ever going to teach you science and health reporting in the country, all those journalism schools in their 1000s, and not a single one of them offers this as a course, there is a course for political reporting, court reporting, entertainment reporting, there’s not a single course, offered by universities in Kenya on science and health reporting. So most of these people are going to be self-taught, and you’re going to make your mistakes along the way. I made my mistakes along the way. So now that I’m here, I started writing about science and health in 2010. In my second year in campus and now 13 years later- are those 13 years? Oh my god, I’m so old.

Vera Vashti Okeyo:

I’m so old joy.

Joy Owango:

No, you’re wise.

Vera Vashti Okeyo:

it is just hitting me.

Joy Owango:

Yes, you’re wise with amazing grey hair.

Vera Vashti Okeyo:

Oh, my God.  As I was telling you, writing daily for 13 years about science, consuming scientific content, hanging around- and most of my circles is made up of scientists, I feel like it’s my job to teach people entering the career, how to navigate that because there are no resources that are going to help them to do that. So I still have my feet in that direction of science journalism. What changes is how I switch those paths for example, when I’m in communications, it’s more about impact. How do I demonstrate that? What we did yielded these results and the audience either the donor, the organization, or the Ministry of Health. Rarely is it the public, sometimes it’s the public, but rarely, nah. Those stories go into reports, I still write stories for reports, because you have to humanize even the numbers, we write stories for conferences, we write stories and they take many forms in communication. It can be a story presented in the form of an infographic. More pictures and graphic elements and fewer words. It can be videos, we have a uterotonic right now called Heat-stable Carbetocin which does not need refrigeration. So how do I present that in visuals, not words? So that’s communication.  In journalism, it’s more like service to mankind, you have to educate people and sometimes I don’t have to do that myself. Sometimes, I’ll see something happening, I’ll watch the news and I have made it a rule that in every given month, I’ll have two reporters as mentees, and I take them through a three-month curriculum on how to report on science.  I take them through it and then watch the stories they write and I’ll tell them, you know, next time, you’re writing about malaria, can you stop using these terms? Next time, interview this person, read this paper, and I’ll send it to them on their WhatsApp, I’ll send them PDFs, I’ll send them articles, I’ll introduce them to people who work in that space, who can give them accurate information. Journalism, for me, it’s not a place where I earn any income. It’s, me giving back right to mankind.  For Jhpiego communications, I earn an income over there, but it’s also more or less like serving mankind in a way, because it is still telling stories, because the support that comes from the Ministry of Health and for all the people we work with, by the end of the day, still going to go into health care, because we mostly work with healthcare.

Joy Owango:

Okay. So as much as you’re seeing it from a perspective, where you’re serving mankind, what I’m also seeing is that you’re building communities. You’re building communities, within the targeted audiences you’re working with at Jhpiego, but at the same time, you’re building committees when it comes to how we can work with the various media houses, especially when it comes to storytelling. How would you define your communities and how would you encourage any science communicator to build? How would you guide them to build such communities, because community engagement is key when you’re a communication specialist and you’re helping support a program or a project. And also, community engagement will be very key when it comes to working with this with science journalists. So tell me, how would you guide an upcoming science communicator right now on how to build their communities?

Vera Vashti Okeyo:

Okay, wow, that’s a really important question. So number one, it is important to tell any storyteller whether a communicator, videographer, journalist, or photographer, that in a field such as science and global health, one hit-wonder ‘manenos’, that doesn’t work. The reason people do not engage Is because they see- I just needed to get the story, right and once I do, I’m out. If you’re working on this project, it is for two years, and after the two years, I’m out. Absolutely not. I think even personally in my career I can name you a few scientists who because of how I interacted with them, I’ve seen them grow in their career, they’ve seen me grow in my career and even the knowledge of the field that you’re working in or in the work that you do is because you start from somewhere, and then you keep going, and particularly for journalism, it’s your name. And a name is not something that you build today, especially in the world where we are flooded with information, you have got to keep consistent. How do you stay consistent? How will people know you’re consistent? You have to engage with them. Ever since I got into Journalism and Communication. I’m known for many things, I play musical instruments. I’m a teacher, qualified teacher, I teach math and physics. But if you ask anyone, they will tell you. Vera is science and health. Despite all those other things. I am known for that science and health and the message has always been very clear that I am pro the community, I’m pro-evidence and I’m pro-people having the best healthcare that can be in the world. And that will mean sometimes you have to campaign for the scientists so that they’re able to do their work. Sometimes you have to campaign for the community because they need to get the services. So engagement means you have to first of all, as a person, before you even reach out to people, you have to be clear on your mission and vision. Don’t talk to me today about science then tomorrow, you’re not interested in it at all, you want to do, I don’t know what. It’s important for people to keep that at a personal level, be clear on your mission and your vision. And number two, people engage only when they want to take something out of the other person.) Occasionally, I can come and tell you, I can see you doing this thing. The other times you have paid me and you’ve treated me as a peer. What can I do for you this time around? You know, I see this thing that you’re doing right here is good and I have the skills, in writing success stories, and I don’t see TCC sharing their success stories. How about I try to teach your team how to tell success stories about TCC, not their partners to keep the work going? So always have an attitude of What can I give to the other person? Don’t be the kind of person who only reaches out when you want to blow your own trumpet. Sometimes call people to tell them, You know what, we have this thing coming up and this new grant coming up but because we’ve been with you guys together, it will be a competitive process. So why don’t you just come up to TCC and we’ll teach you how to put in a proper application? We are not giving you treatment that the other applicants will not get no, we just want you to know how to put together a proper application, and you call them up and train them.  I do that so many times and sometimes I don’t even have to wait for people to give me money from the organization, I will use money from my pocket and will meet up with a group of journalists and I would be like guys. There’s an opportunity here to build your career by telling stories about reproductive health. This is what is happening in the industry, from the nonprofit side, because I’m on that other side of the world. A lot of organizations are focusing on this topic, stop telling us about teenage pregnancy, it’s still an important topic, but you’re also missing this element. Can we tell stories about this element? And I’ll tell them, You’re writing pitches, send me those pitches, and I am going to help you polish them, and then write the story. So that’s for me is engagement, I always ask myself, what can I give before I can ask for something in return?

Joy Owango:

So it’s what you can give and also you from your point of view its also about collaboration. How can we work together to make sure that we are able to achieve our objectives? For you it’s not competition, it’s collaboration. How do you think researchers can best utilize science journalism?

Verah Vashti Okeyo:

Going back to that thing of what can I give? It’s important for science to thrive in an environment where there is literacy for it, you know, for people to understand how science operates. When we are collecting blood samples, we are not going to do some Illuminati things. We are doing research, it is important for the public to understand that, for policy leaders to understand that scientists need reagents, they need labs. If you give someone 1 million to do studies about some Coronavirus, that is very little money, you should not look at it the way you look at, you know, doing laundry or constructing a house. It’s not the same. People need to hire proper people. So you see, once there’s an air of science literacy, scientists are not very good trumpets blowers for themselves. Nowadays, they’re trying but they need to do more. It is unfair to ask scientists to stop doing their work and then come into this world of lobbying and advocacy. It’s hard work. So if journalists make the public aware of what they do, the next time the budget is announced, and we see that for R&D, research, and development, the government has only allocated 1% of the budget. The public will be like are you guys playing? because they know what that entails. So number one, scientists need to collaborate more with journalists not to tell their stories and how their labs are doing well, and how they won this award but to make the public aware. For instance, let’s say one of the people I met in your lab, was a physicist and he was studying something to do with soil health.

Instead of calling the journalist to say something nice about them. How about they teach the reporter and tell them, guys, I need you people to focus on soil health because now everybody’s constructing houses in arable land, and you guys are going to be starving here. And the food is going to be hard to come by and we already have food insecurity. So generally, he`s not telling them to talk about him but about this field and how important. It takes time. It’s not a one-hit-to-wonder kind of thing. I will give you an example of two scientists actually not two but multiple scientists like Professor Kariuki Njenga. He’s from Washington State University. I met him in 2015 and that was the first time I heard about the word Coronavirus and was wondering what those were. I mean, I had never heard of those viruses. Then, immediately after that, we started seeing emerging infectious diseases. MASCOV came up, SASCOB, COVID. And all that time I was able to report about COVID Because, throughout my relationship with Dr. Kariuki Njenga, I got to know about these groups of viruses, how vicious they are, and where research is going for them. And at the same time, when COVID happened, it was easy for reporters like me to talk about Coronavirus because you were not starting at Coronavirus 101, we’d already heard that. And it was easy when the public was asking questions like why the vaccines had not been brought, “We pump so much money in KEMRI, why do they not have a vaccine?” Because there was that kind of conversation going on and were able to explain to the public that the Coronavirus keeps changing so that the vaccine that was made last year cannot work now. Otherwise, we would have just joined that bandwagon. Science cannot thrive in such an environment where people do not understand what they do. So, that is what I tell scientists. “You should not look at journalists as people to build up your profile, actually building up your profile and being in the media is a byproduct of you engaging and using that approach of, what can I give to this field because the journalist will also be looking at the researcher, what can I give to that research,  I better demystify this field it is fascinating. I have to let people know what goes on in KEMRI Wellcome Trust behind those high tower walls, what goes on in there is very important, and how that translates to the care that people get in hospitals and whenever they go for surgery. That is how I would tell people to look at the long term and look at creating an environment of science literacy.

Joy Owango:

So you’re looking at creating an environment of science literacy, because at the end of the day, we have to build a knowledge economy, and it has to start from the information providers who are the scientists in this case. You’re very passionate about your work, and I can hear it in your voice. As we are about to wind up, could you share with me what has been the most defining moment in your career? Do you have any specific case examples that you can share with us that had a significant impact on yourself or the communities that you’ve worked with?

Verah Vashti Okeyo:

Wow, can I really say one defining moment but let me just…

Joy Owango:

Or a few major defining moments.

Verah Vashti Okeyo:

Let me put it this way. When I was at the university, I wasn’t really concerned about becoming a journalist as I said, I studied Creative and Performing Arts and Media. You know what I spent 80% of my time on? the Music Club.

Joy Owango:

Oh, wow.

Verah Vasthi Okeyo:

I love performing. I love playing drums, at the Maseno University band and at that time my professor Caleb Okumu, the great we used to call him the grand Maestro. Professor Caleb Okumu. he liked Rhumba and my dad was in those long Jaluo bands. My dad was a renowned guitarist and so I loved staying there and was like, you know what after I’m done with this I am going into performance.

Joy Owango:

Oh my goodness, you were going to?..

Verah Vashti Okeyo:

That was my plan from the very beginning because I love music, particularly the technical bits of it. One time when we were doing a group assignment I went to Jaramogi Oginga Odinga referral hospital and being the daughter of a nurse and growing up in a very small community, where when you had a problem it was the entire community’s problem, you know, they’d bring you soup when you had malaria to wish you well. You know what I mean?

Joy Owango:

Yes, Yes

Verah Vashti Okeyo:

So while I was still at Jaramogi Oginga Odinga referral hospital, while I was there, I still remember a particular nurse called Anastacia who’s still my friend to date. And I looked at Anastasia in the maternity ward and asked, “ Wait a minute, those women love each other so much that they’re staying in the bed together to give themselves moral support? Anastacia looked at me and rolled her eyes, and explained that they were there because they had to share the bed. Joy. I could not imagine how the beds could be shared because growing up when I was sick, I had my own room. I would have my privacy. I looked at the floor and I looked at the nurses, at the way they were so stressed out and said, that people deserved better, and from then on I decided that I would report about health as an activist. The second defining thing is that growing up, my mom was the kind of person who believed when you’re pregnant, you need to live your best life. So my mother was a midwife and we would crisscross our way through Naivasha to very remote places, where she would take foods, supplements, vaccines on her own, not given by the government, anything. I still have recollections of the way she would talk to those women and I still use some of those tactics in my work now. She would ask them what they wanted to eat and she would carry flour and give to those Maasai women so that they were able to stay healthy. So for me, how I grew up, and looking at my mother and her Midwifery, and then seeing that encounter at Jaramogi Oginga Odinga in  2009, at 22 years- I was old,  staying in a small community and then in high school, I stayed inside a convent, in Bahati, throughout my high school. After I lost my parents, I stayed in a convent, and it was the same thing. When one was sick the nuns would offer soup and prayers. I could not imagine that when people are sick they lived in such conditions. That’s how I got into it, so motivated by my mother’s passion and my childhood experience. Then when I came into the newsroom, I said, from a very young age, I remember telling myself, I would not take the 1000 shillings, that they give reporters to tamper them from writing negative stories. Even when I didn`t have money, Joy, I said, I was going to be a different journalist and sought information from everywhere. I applied for fellowships. I think I got my first grant, four months into the journalism field, just when I got into Nation as an intern for International Center for Journalists (ICFJ), and as I continued interacting with those people, and with scientists, realized that journalism was not just writing stories. It’s much more than that. You have got to apply for grants, you have to shape a lot of narratives in science.  I pursued that and eventually went for my post-grad at the London School of Economics, which also flipped how I approached journalism because I went to a class of Professor Lucy Kanya and Professor Aduragbemi Banke-Thomas. I took courses in health systems in the developing world. Apart from media communication, the LSE allows every semester to take two core courses that are not in your department. So I went to the Health Systems Department, where I studied Population Health, Introduction to Epidemiology and as I was studying there, I realized I had been this thing the wrong way. I’ve been doing this journalism the wrong way. When I came back, I decided, I was going to approach my journalism from a point of health systems, you know, not looking at the disease but looking at what brought this disease here, what was wrong in the system, if it’s cholera, don’t say there are 50 cases of cholera recorded. That’s rubbish. Say, there are no vaccines, there is no clean water and that’s why nothing is happening here. So I decided I was going to take my journalism, from my health system point of view, and also focus on people who are vulnerable. And that’s how the DEI desk at Nation came across. We were no longer going to report on just saying people, five people have died of HIV, 20,000 people have died. That does not help because you’re still going to record those numbers. We need to ask, what is the persona of these people who are constantly being killed by these diseases that are preventable? Who are these people that die of Cholera? So with my boss and I should also add the fourth thing, that I am lucky that while in most of my career I’ve met a lot of toxic people, there’s usually just one person there who was supportive. My first boss Mucheni Wachira from Nakuru always asked that I show what I can do. He always allowed me to experiment and then, while at  Nakuru, one of the editors Mwinzi,  who is still my very good mentor up to now. Mwinzi thought that the place was too small and asked for a transfer for me to come to Nairobi, and allowed me to just do anything I wanted as far as science journalism is concerned. I experimented, I did all these kinds of things. Still at Nation along there, there was  Mutuma Matthew, who I think if it had not been for him, I’d have been fired already because I would try experiments, it would backfire so badly but he’d say, “ Just let that young girl be.” There’s also Pamela Sitoni, Catherine Gicheru, Zipporah Musau, and Judy Ogecha. They were among the people in my career, who allowed me just quote and quote, “Be mad, and see where that madness goes”, and it has landed me where I am.  I can be in communications and excel at it, I can go to journalism and excel at it. If I wanted, I could still go back to music and excel at it because I have never really left any of my passions. I carry them. Everywhere I go, I can’t say that I don’t do music because I’m in journalism, I still write about music once in a while. Over the weekend, I still go to the band and still play to remind myself. I still carry those things. So those are what I could say have been the defining moments for me, those four things.

Joy Owango:

Oh, amazing. I can see why they shaped your career not only as a science journalist but also as a communication specialist.

Verah Vashti Okeyo:

If you ask any of those people, whether they were fond of me they would tell you. Mwinzi would tell you, “Ah! that girl used to drive me nuts with messages at 1 am in the morning, I’m so glad I’ve gotten rid of her.”

Joy Owango:

I also think that life is about being given chances and you were given quite a number of chances, and you took them and that is the most important thing. I’d like you to share with me your parting shots. You`ve shared with us your journey, the influence from your parents, the influence when your eyes were opened when you saw the state of the healthcare system, what inspires you to write stories and how to write stories and those who’ve actually guided you and allowed you to experiment. All these have defined you to be the person you are today. With all said and done, what are your parting shots?

Verah Vashti Okeyo:

My parting shot, wow, this looks like a TED talk, man. My parting shot would be three things. Number one, be thirsty for knowledge in whichever field you are in. Number two, be humble enough to know that no matter how much you know there’s still room to learn something. You can never be an expert until you don’t need more. Number three, you have to send yourself, do not wait to be assigned things. It doesn’t have to succeed, you have to try and you have to try boldly despite naysayers. You have to do it, you have to send yourself,  “Kujituma” as they say Kiswahili, do it boldly. do not be conventional. I think conventional is basic, be avant-garde. My friend be avant-garde, if it was fashion, do something that people seeing you will be surprised at, for once in life just do something crazy that people will never stop talking about, even if it’s once along the line, the path of you trying to pursue an avant-garde idea. It is because if you do 20, you will fail 17 times, but in every failure, there are lessons so that when you do it the 18th, the 19th, and the 20th time, ‘Ni kama you have learned project management, product management, HR, you have learned everything that there is to take an idea from fruition to the end. So do not stay there waiting to be assigned things go there and do what you’re supposed to do with everything you’ve got.

Joy Owango:

Yeah, and I think what you’re trying to say is to be ready. Be comfortable with accommodating wild ideas. It’s okay to accommodate wild ideas.

Vera Vashti Okayo:

Absolutely. Can you imagine, (I’m a spiritual person) you didn’t die today someone else did? God forbid, you are healthy and then you become ordinary? Why waste this health, your ability to walk, talk, run, and read, you have eyesight, you have ears. Why would you waste that being okay, just someone people can forget in a minute? Be extraordinary.  I know if I died right now, my friends would have a lot of extraordinary stories to tell about my life. I cannot be ordinary because it is an honor and a blessing to be alive and to be healthy. Those are alive, sane, and healthy. Those are gifts and people should not waste them asking for permission to exist. Absolutely not. If God did not want you to stay here. He would have taken you out already.

Joy Owango:

Thank you so much Verah. This was really inspiring. I really enjoyed this conversation with you. What has come out very clearly from this conversation is that it’s okay to try fail and try some more. It is okay. It is important to identify opportunities and it’s okay to be aggressive in identifying those opportunities and when it is presented to you. We should be quick and smart enough to accommodate them, always seek help and that is what I`m seeing from your journey, always be ready to seek help and when help is provided always accept it, and its always a way of building your own community, not only the professional community but also your personal community in making you the person that you are. Thank you so much Vera, this was very inspiring.

Verah Vashti Okeyo:

Thank for having me, it`s always a pleasure talking to you Joy.

Outro

Thanks for joining us on today’s episode of Mazungumzo podcast. Be sure to subscribe and follow us on all our channels. For more updates and for candid stories by researchers, policymakers, higher education leaders, and innovators on their journeys. See you in our next episode.

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