SN 3 EP4: Exploring the Power of Podcasts and Digital Platforms for African Research Impact with Root of Science’s Anne Chisa

EPISODE SUMMARY

In this special collaboration episode, Joy Owango of Mazungumzo – African Scholarly Conversations and Anne Chisa of The Root of Science Podcast come together for a dynamic and insightful discussion.

They explore how their platforms have grown into vital spaces for amplifying African research, highlighting the transformative power of science communication. Joy reflects on her 18 years of experience training researchers and building systems for scholarly communication, while Anne shares her journey of showcasing African scientists and their stories to inspire global audiences.

Here Are the Key Things to Look Out For

• The Evolution of Science Communication in Africa: Joy and Anne reflect on how science communication has transformed over the years, thanks to technology and generational shifts.
• The Stories Behind the Platforms: Both hosts share the personal journeys that led them to create their podcasts and the impact of amplifying African voices.
• The Power of Collaboration: This episode showcases the value of partnerships in creating stronger platforms for African research storytelling.
• Lessons for the Future: The conversation ends with a shared vision for the future of science communication in Africa.

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Anne Chisa

Hello and good morning everyone. Welcome to another episode of the Root of SciencePodcast with your girl  Anne with and E. Today It’s a really special episode, because I am not alone. I am teaming up with the one and only Joy Owango, from the Mazungumzo – African Scholarly Conversations to join me on this joint episode. Joy, hi.

Joy Owango

Anne, this is so exciting. Yes, I’m Joy, and we’re excited to bring both of our audiences together for this episode. Whether you’re listening from the root of science podcast or Mazungumzo – African Scholarly Conversations, you are in for a great conversation. So let’s get into it.

Anne Chisa

Absolutely um Joy. I think maybe for my podcast audience, they might not know who you are. So the first question is that you know your podcast, Mazungumzo, has created a really unique and important platform to discuss African research, particularly in this landscape. So for those who are unaware, what issues do you actually focus on, and why are these conversations so important.

Joy Owango

Okay, so Mazungumzo is a podcast produced by the Training Center in Communication. It’s a research capacity trust based out of the University of Nairobi in Kenya. So we’ve been training researchers for the last 18 years on how to communicate their research, whether it’s scholarly or science communication, and we realized that there was no podcast focusing on higher education and scholarly and science communication in the continent. What are our researchers doing? When we started this, I was like, what are our researchers doing? Who is talking about it? Do we have to wait for international podcasts or media houses to cover it. Why can’t we hear what they’re doing, whether they are well known researchers or early career researchers? Let’s see and hear what is going on in the continent. And the beauty about a digital platform or digital communications is that it will just blow up. So it’s just not localized, it gives access to a global audience on the conversations we are doing. So we were very deliberate. We said we wanted to interview Africans or partners who are working in Africa, but predominantly Africans, let them have their conversations on what is happening. Let the world know what is happening on scholarly communication and science communication in Africa, because it is huge. We have the usual subject, you know, like STEM, Women in Science, maternal health, these or even research on food security. These are relevant research areas, but they all connect to scholarly communication. They all connect to science communication because it’s about visibility of your work. So that is how we set up Mazungumzo, and I’m really happy about it, because you’re our second partner in this in the podcast space, and we look forward to this partnership. Tell me more about the root of science and why you started it, and what have you gained out of it?

Anne Chisa

Yeah, I mean, just listening to your motivation for starting your podcast, there’s a lot of similar similarities, and it’s quite beautiful that, you know, you were in Kenya and you saw the same problem. And  I was in South Africa and I saw the same problem where it was. You know us as researchers, we are doing amazing work, African researchers, right? You know, the ability to see our research being communicated, particularly to society. It’s not that out there. It’s usually, you know, your journals, which are great, but not everybody reads them. So that was one thing, we’re working with we as scientists, we do research to solve societal issues. So how do we go back and translate our findings to society? And I think another important thing when I was doing this is that I realized that there was a visibility issue. It was, a problem. It was very difficult to see scientists who look like us, who are Africans in mainstream media, because the stereotypical image is of someone who’s probably from the west and they’re much older. But the truth of the fact is that scientists who look like  you and I as well. So that was also part of the reason that I wanted to amplify them. I wanted to amplify that. That’s that’s how the Root of Sciencecame together, and that’s what really inspired me to start this platform. And it’s been beautiful, because as much as, like I said, that we amplify Africans. Another important thing that I wanted to showcase is that Africans are are all over the globe. They’re doing really amazing things, and it’s another thing where somebody can aspire to be like, I know someone who is from my village in Malawi, or not even a village, but like, I know a Malawian who is in Russia, and they’re doing science. And it’s one of the main important things that I show Africans all over the globe, who are doing absolutely amazing work and innovations. And I mean, it’s evolved, in a beautiful way, from from it not being, I don’t know what to call it. Iit felt like a pitch project initially, like I didn’t know what I was doing, but now here we are. It’s like a little child that I’ve been raising,  it’s like a baby that I’ve been raising and now reaching out and connecting with people like yourself, where we like, Hey, we’re doing something similar. Let’s come together. Let’s, take it to the next level. Precisely, so Joy, you’ve said that you’ve been in this communication field for a long time, like you said that you were TCC training people for over 20 years. So how has the landscape evolved, in your view?

Joy Owango

Oh my goodness, wow, we were facing the same problem like you were facing. You chose a digital platform, so we started with the actual training, because we realized this was about 18 years ago. We realized, Oh, I was in a project where we had biosafety and biotechnology scientists being the same project, writing scholarly publications, and none of them understood each other. And I was like, how is it possible? You’re not even talking about you’re talking to non scientists. People are asking questions, I don’t understand what is written in his paper. So that is when we approach the University of Nairobi and we say, You know what, we want to help the academic community by guiding them on how they can write scholarly communication and  write publications where other researchers who are not in their field could understand but it was just about the time when funders were demanding for multidisciplinary approach to research. So how can you explain to me you’re a biological scientist and a social scientist is not going to understand your work, and yet you have to work together. I mean examples, typical examples, like research on malaria. Wherever you go in Africa, there’s research on malaria, there’s an entomologist who’s going to work on it. There’s going to be a health scientist going to work on it, a social scientist, an economist. They have to understand each other’s work. So that is how we started training scientists. We’ve been doing that. We do that every month, training on scholarly communication. Then we realized, Okay, so  we’re kind of helping you on how to improve writing, and writing to different audiences, scientific communities. Now, how can you communicate to non scientists?

You know you need to now look at your paper and say, Okay, how can I create an opinion editorial out of this? How can I get a news article out of this? So for us, we started doing the grant work. I like calling it grant work, because it made us see all these other dynamics of the challenges that came about. And we are so proud of that, because we’ve trained over 30,000 researchers. Okay, and it’s amazing, and we have our calendars booked back to back, and now, with the rise of technology, it’s showing them the various open access research solutions that they can use to improve their research discovery, which leads to producing better quality research and using the various solutions that can aid now digital solutions that can aid them in writing better okay, so you see everything is gelling, and from that space, we realized we need to reach a larger audience, and because now the scientist are doing their part. They are no longer worried about, how am I going to write this? Because they know  there’s a support system for that. What happens if my work is misconstrued, misquoted? No, we’ve guided them on how to write and how to protect themselves from that. So meaning you’ll have, if you’re talking about your research in the press, you’d have to base it on published work. Nobody’s going to question published work. Okay, people will question maybe the data. But if the data is negative, it is the data. It’s not You’re not going to change it to suit your needs. It is the data as it is, so we’ve seen a change from scientists being worried about communicating their work to non scientists, to them now coming up for our trainings and saying, Yes, I need this because they know, not because even the fund wants It is because they know there’s, a paradigm shift in communication because of digital communications, and they need to be relevant. We are living in an information age where people are demanding access to information, and scientists are still trusted as a source of information. So that has really changed. Funders have become very receptive to science communication before it used to be that’s the last thing you know, it’s communications, so you’re having a little budget, and you’re wondering, how am I going to support the entire ecosystem? But now it is become the primary budget. But then on the same time now with the rise of digital communications like podcasts, Tiktok we are seeing scientists opening up and talking about their work. That’s why we have academic tiktoks. We have academic podcasts, and they’re becoming more confident. So it’s not only a paradigm shift, but it’s also a generational shift. This has literally taken a generation. My father was a scientist, and there was no way he would have done this. Oh, God, no. He was the director of the largest agricultural research center in East and Central Africa. As long as he’s published his work, he’s good, there was no way. And then along come his children, who say, yeah, you should use social media. You know, we should use these other platforms. You know, look at me like I’ve grown an extra head. So you see, it’s generational. So our generation and your generation are adapting to technology, influencing funders and policy makers to adapt to technology in communicating science. So that is such a good thing, and what I can say is that there are more positive responses ahead, with scientists becoming more confident about sharing their knowledge. And also coming from Africa, you know, based on what you’re saying, more Africans are saying, we need to talk about our stories. We need to talk about our research. We need to show our contribution to the world on what we are doing in various research areas, not just being recipients of funding, but this is what we are doing. This is what we are trying to export in terms of knowledge. So we are not going to wait for somebody to trumpet it for you, and that is why now they are making that deliberate effort to communicate their work.

Anne Chisa

Absolutely amazing. I like what you said about the shift. I don’t know if you’ve noticed, but I think it’s becoming a little bit more accelerated. Do you think we can keep up with how fast things are changing? Because, I’m thinking from four years ago, when I started, when I mentioned podcasting, people looked at me like, What are you talking about? Even when I was starting this, everyone was like, this is a distraction. Focus on we, write, I don’t know, blogs or whatever. Like, nobody wants to hear this version. But then now, like you said that there, people are like, oh, yeah. Now,  you can see organizations are okay, we trying to create a way to be accessible digitally, and we want to be, and I’m like, Oh, well, finally, welcome, to the party.

Joy Owango

Then it has become a rabbit hole. Have you noticed it feels like an Alice in Wonderland rabbit hole, because technology moves at a very fast phase. That’s why I’m saying the acceleration is on jet fuel, and then you find yourself in this Wonderland, rabbit hole, trying to figure out, okay, so what works? How do I how do I make it work for me? Because, just like when we started our. Podcast, and then we went into the Tiktok sphere. And everybody was like, why? It was a very cautious, scary why? Everybody, you know, when you tell them, yes but we have an academic Tiktok, why are you doing this? And within a month, no, within three months, we had over 10,000 followers. We had viral videos. And it’s the same thing, talking on scholarly publishing, supporting you on the research life cycle. So it is with the rise of this, digital communications and digital platforms, and with their fast pace in development, we need to be strategic on what works for us and make the best out of it. Because it is developing on jet fuel, it’s going so fast. And for someone who’s never been in this space. It is a rabbit hole. It is a rabbit hole, and each of those, when you get into that Wonderland, each of them have an audience, and they have certain expectations, and that audience is going to engage you if you give them information. So one has to be very strategic. So for organizations that I want to get into this sphere, especially when they adapting to digital communications, they have to be a bit more strategic about what works for them. But at the same time, be warned, it is a rabbit hole that you’re getting into. And what about you, what have you noticed on your side

Anne Chisa

I think you’re absolutely right that now a lot of people, like I rightfully said now, are realizing, hey, maybe we need to start doing this, but I don’t think they’re well equipped to do it, because it’s not the same thing. And sometimes just because you’re a scientist does not mean you’re a science communicator, and I think that’s why what we are doing and what we do is important, to be that go between and I’ve really, realized that as well, that as much as you are wanting to do it, sometimes the way that you do it is not the same way that we would have done it, because we’ve had the experience. We’ve been able to test things out that are working, things that are not working. And as much as,  I’m really excited that institutions are wanting to be on but I think it’s important to have platforms like ourselves, or maybe reach out to people like ourselves to say, hey, we’ve seen the work that you are doing help us. And I mean, that’s why we are here.

Joy Owango

Plugging into those existing systems to expand your visibility, because it takes time to build an audience base, and also it’s, trial and error, and this is something you also go into. It’s a trial and error process. But most importantly, it’s also recognizing that podcasts are the new media, that exists. So you cannot start creating your own media, and you end up having fragmented conversations. And this is why we are  having this partnership so that we are speaking the same voice. We are cross pollinating our audiences, so that they know what is happening on each side. I think also, it is an exciting moment for most research organizations, also an Ah moment that, oh, they are platforms you can work with, but they also need to be aware of the sustainability of it. It’s not I have a great idea. Let’s set up a podcast. You need to start asking yourself, do I have enough content for an entire season? And this is where everybody talks in fear because we’ve had such conversations and you’re like, yes, we want to set up a podcast. Brilliant. So give me ideas for season 1 and I’m not talking about weekly podcast. I’m talking about monthly podcast. Give me an idea. Give me ideas for season one and season two halfway, so that we are not going to be rushing. Okay, so you don’t have content, give me ideas of where you’re going to get your content. So digital platforms are good, but you need to look beyond. And the beyond bit is the sustainability aspect. Okay, if you don’t have that in mind, it’s going to collapse because it is a media platform like any other media platform, you need to ask yourself, How can we become competitive in the sense that, people can see us,how do we partner with various platforms so that people can see it from now a continental level. They stop seeing a podcast. They are seeing, Oh, there are series of podcasts in this area coming out of the continent, that is sustainability as well. And when it is a media house, it means that you have staff. At some point, you’ll have stuff, you have an editor, you have a producer, you have a content producer. You have all those, how are you going to pay them? So it’s no longer, I’m doing this from my nice little corner in the sitting room, in the bedroom, in the dungeon if you have, it’s a team. It’s a media house. And so it’s, something that organizations need to critically ask themselves what they intend to do. It’s fun and games, until when you realize you can’t sustain the podcast.

Anne Chisa

So, I want to ask you, has there been a moment in you doing this work because, you’ve been doing it for a long time, training scientist, where you felt, I can’t,  I’ve had enough, I want to quit. And then how did you overcome that, what made you not quit? Because obviously you haven’t.

Joy Owango

Goodness, there’s a time when we were training and we had two people in the training room, and I was really sure you’re having problems communicating your work. And I remember that day I was so upset, but the two came,

you see, they still made a commitment, and it was on my part to just say, You know what, there will be ups and downs. So you just need to be committed and be consistent. Those two, where the connecting dot of consistency to the next 100. These days we train up to there was a time we did a training and we had 1500 in the class, online it was so overwhelming. And then we did it again. It was 700 and we’re like, this is a lot, but I always remember those two, they are a connecting dot to consistency. So what makes me not give up is that I remind myself that the community needs a consistent ecosystem, not because whether they funding or not, because, don’t get me wrong, programs on science and scholarly communication exist a lot in funded projects, because the funder will demand good quality publications where you publish your work, they’ll want that work accessible, so they’ll pay for it. So what happens to the greater community that doesn’t have funding? Big universities. What happens to the smaller universities? So that level of consistency has found us in a situation whereby most of our trainers in the beginning were masters students. Now, three quarters of all our trainers are PhDs, PhDs in their 50s and 60s now they are younger, so now they are even using digital platforms when they are training.. And we also seeing a situation the people we trained are now becoming trainers when they had their masters, they had their undergrads, now they have their PhDs. So one needs to be consistent. How about you with the podcast, how did it go? I’m sure there are times you you looked at your numbers and they’re like.

Anne Chisa

Yes, to be honest, in the podcasting world, everything is about numbers, and we make it because you think of these big podcasts where they have millions of followers, but for me,  because you’re like, Oh no, whydo I only in the beginning you have 10 people, And I was like, am I doing what I meant to be doing? And I love what you said about consistency before I speak about the other parts.. That’s what made people come to me, Anne, we’ve seen your work. We’ve seen your consistent and it’s a game changer, even if it’s, every single week. There are weeks where I don’t even want to, there are days where my life is happening, life is happening to me, and I don’t want to. But the the major thing that I’ve seen is that when people want to collaborate, they want to work with you. They look they’re like, Oh, we’ve seen you’ve been so consistent, you’ve done all of this work. And I’m like, oh, okay, at least, it wasn’t in vain. It makes a huge difference. And on the numbers aspect with podcasting, I think I had a conversation with She’s someone who I really admire, but she’s in a very different niche. She’s in true  crime podcasting. So this is when I first  started doing a podcast, I was joining all these Facebook groups, and it was mainly people in the US, because this is 2020, before COVID. Nobody knew what a podcast was even on Spotify. It was only available in Kenya, South Africa, Egypt and Nigeria. Those are the only countries, but the other parts, nobody was there. So anyway, there’s this lady who being friendly with and I really chat to her sometimes, and she said to me, You know what, Anne, you are in a niche, right? Podcasting has got specific niches. You are in a niche, and you have to honor your niche. You have to honor your audience. And sometimes we get so wrapped up in wanting to have 10,000 people listen to us, but you’ve got 50 people who come onto your podcast every single week. And I think sometimes we really need to start realizing that we have to honor our audience, and we have to honor our listeners, because they are the ones who keep on coming back. So that’s what I always tell people, that you have to understand, we are in academia. Okay, fine we are in science, then we are in academia. Or, well, we’re in academia, then it’s like science, and then you get more and more. So then it starts to get a little bit, you know, smaller and smaller and smaller. And you have to understand you are in a niche field. You are an independent you don’t have the producers, you don’t have the marketing as Joe Rogan ever.

Joy Owango

Joe Rogan?

Anne Chisa

No, I mean, that’s the one. Because every single time I say I’m a podcast, somebody goes, oh, like, Joe Rogan, not him,  No, I’m the one. But I think that’s what. If I can say anything to anyone who’s starting a podcast that is starting this journey. Consistency and honor your audience.

Joy Owango

I like that honor and be committed to your audience. Yeah, it is a marriage, eh? It’s through till death do you part? And hopefully the death doesn’t happen.

Anne Chisa

Do you have people where they will send you a message, sorry to cut you. They’ll be like, Oh, we haven’t seen you, when you go on a bit of a break, oh, was there a person you didn’t upload last week. I remember when I changed my uploading to I used to upload every week, but then I did every twice a week. So somebody messaged me the the first time that we did it. Oh, on Monday we saw you didn’t have podcast, and I’m like, Oh no, I’m uploading every two weeks. So that’s when I realized. I was like, oh my goodness, I am an American.

Joy Owango

No, you see one of the things. Okay, so my content producer asked, Are we going to produce this every week? Every two weeks? I was like, No, you do it every month, once a month. And we will make sure that the world knows that this podcast is coming. We’ll do trailers, you know, there will be stories leading to the podcast. And then once the podcast is out, it is, it will just snowball it out so that people know about it and the and, that was on hindsight. And, when she came back to me, she was like, Yeah, that was a good idea. Why? Because people are listening. I’ve been to Europe, I’ve been to the Middle East, I’ve been to Asia, where people say, Oh yeah, we’ve, listened to your podcast. That is scary, because in your mind, you’re thinking, Ah, because we’re based in Kenya, East Africa and South Africa, West Africa and a bit of North Africa. Then when you look at the analytics, you’re like, oh my goodness, there are people listening to this. So that commitment, as you said, honoring your audience is so important, and it is the the beauty of honoring the audience is what makes the world know what we are doing, and it is brought about by consistency. So there are times you look at the numbers, you’re like, oh goodness, what happened here. But then it’s a podcast, you have the right to reshare it. The world can see it again in case you missed it and all that. So nothing is lost. And it’s on a digital platform. It is perpetual. People will always have access to it, right. And then I’m also seeing now a situation where some of the major stakeholders on the continent in scholarly and science communication, reaching out to us so that we can interview them, talking about the work they’re doing. That is such an honor. And we are finalizing season three now, preparing for season four. And the scary thing was that when we were nominated, we got two nominations through Afripods. And I was like, Oh, we are that good. Sometimes you think, so you are like, oh, so we actually doing something right, not one, but two nominations. And it that goes to show that people are listening and podcast curators are looking for different types of audiences and niches that are being supported by various podcasts. It’s just not the usual true crime, business, finance, it’s what’s happening in higher education, what’s happening, you know, so and that is good to see, and that evolution of digital communication is a big plus for us, and we are riding that wave. We are riding that way.

Anne Chisa

It’s an exciting time for Africans and the African communication space. Speaking of audience Joy, I’m sure people can our listeners are like, okay, that’s great. You guys are doing all of this amazing thing. So for somebody who is my audience, what can they expect if they are like, I’ve now know about Mazungumzo , when they come to your podcast, what can they expect when they listen in?

Joy Owango

Okay. So what they can expect is understanding the ecosystem that helps make their research visible, and the various partners on the continent that can aid them, and the trends they can take advantage of, especially when it comes to making their work visible and accessible. Let’s remember that research is an expensive process. Publishing, is expensive, as it were, and we’ve been seeing researchers struggling to have access to information, and the fact that our podcast looks and works with the various stakeholders on the continent to make information free of charge, free to read, free to publish. It is going to show them the various technologies, trends, stakeholders who are aiding in helping this, and also it will guide them in knowing what is happening, even in the individual countries. We are really excited about one of the podcasts interviews we’re going to host at the next month. And this is the African journals online. And you’re going to be talking about diamond open access. Now, if you look at let’s start from African journals online aspect of it. It is a bibliographic database which only hosts African journals. So your researchers once you’ve done your research and they’re like, I want to publish in African journals. Are Africans even producing journals? There is a database with all that. And these are indexed databases, high quality journals that are indexed not only in the in Africa, but globally. Okay. Then there’s the diamond Open Access conference that is happening. When you talk about diamond open access, it means that as a researcher, it is free for you to publish and free for you to read. So it’s free, 100% free. So understanding these trends that are happening on the continent will impact where this person is going to publish his work, and how it will help increase the visibility of his work or her work. So it is the next step. So Anne chooses audience, know this, you’ve done your research, you’ve published. You are in the process of publishing. Mazungumzo  comes in with the next steps. What are the trends? Where can you publish? Who are the stakeholders to make sure that you’re able to publish in open access platforms, and how can you make your work accessible? And who in Africa is helping you to make this possible? Because for the longest time, people would say, um, yeah, are Africans publishing? Is anyone in Africa even supporting the ecosystem? Yes, there is a whole litany of stakeholders who are helping. So these are the people we are interviewing, so that you know, what is there in your region or in your country to help. So that is what you’d expect to hear from us, and it will be both in scholarly and science communication. So.

Anne Chisa

Oh, that’s very exciting.

Joy Owango

Yeah. And then for you, tell us, what are we going to get from your side?

Anne Chisa

Oh, lovely. So for us, on the Root of SciencePodcast,  we have two different types of conversations. So we have more nuanced conversations, where we have specific series that are themed, that are focused on particular topics. So for example, right now, we are doing something called rooted in health. And we are speaking about some, health issues that are such as sexual and reproductive health. We’re speaking on the idea of HP, the vaccine. What are some innovations? What are policy? What are some of the solutions, technological who is funding it? We spoke on nutrition, what are some of the big stakeholders that are funding these types of research, etcetera. And then we have more. This is sort of the the bread and butter of why I started this podcast. We have more conversational conversations where we bring in a scientist or researcher, an innovator, and we have a candid conversation, because when I started the Root of Sciencepodcast, I wanted to know, a scientist, that you’re more than just a scientist, as much as we’re going to understand about your research. I want you to know the Root of Science . Who are you, What else do you do? What are some of your struggles? So we have more candid conversations. Then we’ll have something where it’s like AI in health, which is very serious. We’re speaking to the experts. We’re speaking to the innovators, the people who are developing solutions. And then we also have the visible role models where we have young, up and coming researchers, or somebody who is in the thick of it, and they’re telling you that this is my my story of doing a PhD in Oxford, or my story of doing a PhD in or masters in Russia or here in Africa. And we’re like hey, I can relate to some of these things we talk about, such issues of like mental health, being away from home, visa issues. So these are conversations that  Africans can relate to globally. So it’s that whole idea that we amplify the work, and we also have very rich, nuanced conversations. So that you can find our series. We did innovative solutions, in Africa. Women in AI, which was really, really cool. African woman in AI, particularly, because,  AI is something that’s really on the topic. But women are also behind it, African women, what are they doing? So we have various different themes and we work with other organizations and partners, and we create conversations, and we go, for example, I was in Lindau, which is in Germany. We went to go and see the Lindau noble laureates. So I had conversations with some of the prize winners, so some stuff like this, where we get to travel, we put that onto the show, and you’re like, these are Africans in who are, young scientists who are attending physics. So these are some of the things that you can come in and you can come and see so you are speaking on, publishing your research. Okay, once you’ve published it, have a conversation about your research.

Joy Owango

Yes, let’s talk about it.

Anne Chisa

Or, maybe let’s focus on what type of, I don’t know, bio. What was that you said something about bio information, or?  Bio-technology.

Joy Owango

Bio-technology, yes.

Anne Chisa

So maybe, we could have a whole episode focused on African bio-technology. And then the beauty is that now we could go and we can be like, hey, Mazungumzo, who has spoken about biotechnology in Africa? Then we can potentially have them onto the show. So that’s that whole cross pollination that we are talking about. And these are some of the things that I’m really excited that our partnership will do.

Joy Owango

That is great. Now as we as we are wrapping up, because we are both podcasters, and we pretty much jumped into the murky waters and somehow survived. What do you see as the future of our podcasts, in terms of influencing researchers, influencing communication and influencing the trends on how African researchers can effectively communicate their work.

Anne Chisa

Oh, that’s a great question. I think our podcast has such great potential to really influence these conversations, because apart from just raising awareness, which is really, really important, I think we can then start having, how do I say this? Then we can now start having a place of, so what like? What can we do with this research? That we’re doing. What does policy say about it? Because it’s all well and good, because ultimately it always ends up there right where for implementation purposes. So I think our conversation, I mean, our podcast, can be a conversation starter. Do we then maybe start bringing in the people where we like, would love to have a conversation with you and a scientist, and then start asking those questions, really getting to the meat of it. And I think it’s really, really exciting, because when I started this, like you rightfully said, it was very murky waters. It was me just doing a passion project. But I’ve realized I have an idea. Yes, it’s so much more. It’s more than it just being about me and my passion project. I’ve seen the impact that it has. Because even with the people we interview on our show, somebody notices them, and they’re like, hey, you had this person who was on your show. I’d love to talk to them. Maybe have an area of explanation and we also become that, like for my vision for the podcast, not even the podcast, the Root of Science media to be that premier platform where, when you think of African communication, you think of us, and where, even now, we see the beauty of it, where we’re like, hi, Anne, do you know someone who is doing work in neuroscience, or cardiology? And I’m like, hey, I think I’ve interviewed someone a long time ago. Or, I know someone who knows someone who can help, to do it. And I think great, because that’s what we amplify, so that somebody can be like we know who to ask, because you are the person having these conversations with these researchers as well. What about you?

Joy Owango

You know, two things. Number one is we want to amplify the state of scholarly communication in Africa, because scholarly communication is the direct cause and effect which leads to the effect of the visibility of African research. It’s one thing to do the work, but it’s where you publish, how you publish, avenues that you choose that will make it accessible. So we want to be the conduit where African researchers know that there’s a platform talking about all the stakeholders who can help in aiding the visibility of their work. Number two, we want the world to understand the trends and the contributions Africa is making in making research accessible, whether it is continental innovations, whether it is continental engagements with whether it’s going to be at an infrastructural level, publishing level, even policy level. Let the world know what is happening in Africa, in making in terms of scholarly communication and science communication. Because when you look at those two subjects, you think it’s just an issue of publishing. No, it is. There’s infrastructure involved. There’s policy involved. There’s a lot of engagement involved. So what are we doing to support that, such that we have a progressive conversation on the same so we want to be the go to partner. Then just like you, we’re in a situation whereby we have stakeholders reaching out to us. Oh, do you know so and so? And you’re like, No, no, we have interviewed them already on our podcast, or we intend to interview them. So we’re already seeing how we’re becoming a resource. Its such a nice unintended consequence, and I hope that we will continue with that trend and influence conversations when it comes to scholarly and science communication, and also blend it seamlessly with various podcasts that are science based or research based. So I think it’s exciting times ahead. Adapting to technology was definitely a rabbit hole. People started in social media, and here we are, okay, but I feel, as you said, it’s a good time to be an African scientist. Yeah, we have our issues. I love my continent. It has its issues, but it’s a good time to be an African. It’s a good time to be an African scientist, because we are in control of our narratives. And we are taking advantage of various platforms to talk about our narratives, to talk about our word and our podcasts are helping in achieving that. And I couldn’t think of a better way to to wind up by saying that, yes, we jumped into murky waters, by the water is getting clearer right now.

Anne Chisa

Definitely is. You rightly said, this is a wonderful place to wind up, and it’s exciting. I’m excited. I’m excited for your listeners to have another source of, African science content, and my listeners as well, and also the wonderful partnerships and other amazing things that will come from us collaborating. It looks like next year is going to be very, very exciting.

Joy Owango

It is. Thank you so much for having me. I am so excited about our partnership. Thank you so much Anne.

Anne Chisa

Thank you so much Joy. And to everybody else who’s tuned in. Thank you so much for listening to another episode of the Root of Science Podcast until next time goodbye.

Outro:

Thanks for joining us on today’s episode of Mazungumzo podcast. Be sure to subscribe and follow us on all our channels for more updates and candid stories by researchers, policymakers, higher education leaders, and innovators on your journeys. See you in our next episode.

Listen to the full episode and explore more episodes from the #Mazungumzo- African Scholarly Conversations podcast on the following platforms:

Buzzsprout: https://www.buzzsprout.com/2140692/episodes/16447533

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/episode/6SF7Bfad9BmkLsQTi82DOQ?si=f4204e72bab947c8

Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/mazungumzo-african-scholarly-conversations/id1652483621

Afripods: https://afripods.africa/podcast/426e65f3-2c86-4c95-99af-a7ac9de09584

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